Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

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Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Branko Čibej
Hi all,

I'm writing here because I believe OpenOffice uses Serf as its HTTP
client; at least I did find version 1.2.1 mentioned in the patch files
in ext_libraries/serf.

I would like to ask for help from the OpenOffice developers to test the
next release of Serf. We — the Apache Serf project — are in the (very
slow) process of finally releasing Serf version 1.4.0, and it would be
helpful if we could get some feedback from testing it.

This version should be source-compatible with 1.2.1, but the build
system has been completely changed since then; the supported build uses
scons but there's also a fairly complete CMake build. Major improvements
include support for HTTP/2, FCGI, CRL, OCSP stapling and OCSP requests,
OpenSSL 1.1.x and and of course a large number of bug fixes. For
details, see: https://s.apache.org/9259

If you're able and willing to help, please respond here, or post to
<[hidden email]>.

Thanks!

-- Brane


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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Matthias Seidel
Hi Branko, Hi all,

Am 13.11.18 um 12:39 schrieb Branko Čibej:
> Hi all,
>
> I'm writing here because I believe OpenOffice uses Serf as its HTTP
> client; at least I did find version 1.2.1 mentioned in the patch files
> in ext_libraries/serf.

It is even mentioned on your project page. ;-)

> I would like to ask for help from the OpenOffice developers to test the
> next release of Serf. We — the Apache Serf project — are in the (very
> slow) process of finally releasing Serf version 1.4.0, and it would be
> helpful if we could get some feedback from testing it.

I would not call me a developer, but I just started a build of
OpenOffice on Windows with Serf 1.3.9 (instead of 1.2.1).

So far no problems. But I don't know where it is used and what to look
for...

> This version should be source-compatible with 1.2.1, but the build
> system has been completely changed since then; the supported build uses
> scons but there's also a fairly complete CMake build. Major improvements
> include support for HTTP/2, FCGI, CRL, OCSP stapling and OCSP requests,
> OpenSSL 1.1.x and and of course a large number of bug fixes. For
> details, see: https://s.apache.org/9259
>
> If you're able and willing to help, please respond here, or post to
> <[hidden email]>.

I think it would be a good idea to upgrade Serf in our builds.

What about the others (real developers)? ;-)

Regards,

   Matthias

> Thanks!
>
> -- Brane
>
>
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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Branko Čibej
On 13.11.2018 21:49, Matthias Seidel wrote:
> Hi Branko, Hi all,
>
> Am 13.11.18 um 12:39 schrieb Branko Čibej:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I'm writing here because I believe OpenOffice uses Serf as its HTTP
>> client; at least I did find version 1.2.1 mentioned in the patch files
>> in ext_libraries/serf.
> It is even mentioned on your project page. ;-)

Yes, and in our Board reports, one of which I posted today ... and that
made me wonder and eventually write a mail to this list. :)


-- Brane


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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Andrea Pescetti-2
In reply to this post by Matthias Seidel
Matthias Seidel wrote:
> I think it would be a good idea to upgrade Serf in our builds.
> What about the others (real developers)? ;-)

Years ago, we had to avoid upgrading Serf in 4.1.x as Serf had started
to require SCons for the build and we didn't want to introduce yet
another build system since we already had too many.

I see it still requires SCons, but probably we've included support for
SCons in trunk in the meantime, so... well, we decided we can live with
yet another build system! Still, I doubt we can use it for 4.1.x as
SCons integration would be needed and I don't think we support it in 4.1.x.

Regards,
   Andrea.

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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Branko Čibej
On 13.11.2018 22:23, Andrea Pescetti wrote:
> Matthias Seidel wrote:
>> I think it would be a good idea to upgrade Serf in our builds.
>> What about the others (real developers)? ;-)
>
> Years ago, we had to avoid upgrading Serf in 4.1.x as Serf had started
> to require SCons for the build and we didn't want to introduce yet
> another build system since we already had too many.

I can surely relate to that ...

> I see it still requires SCons,

The 1.3.x branch does, but for 1.4.x and trunk, you can use CMake for
most purposes. The CMake build currently doesn't support GSSAPI and
BROTLI compression, but other than that it is (in my not so humble
opinion) superior to the SCons build.

> but probably we've included support for SCons in trunk in the
> meantime, so... well, we decided we can live with yet another build
> system! Still, I doubt we can use it for 4.1.x as SCons integration
> would be needed and I don't think we support it in 4.1.x.

That's OK, any kind of testing, even with OO trunk, would be welcome.
The only other Serf consumer I can test is Subversion, adding even one
more would make out real-life testing increase by 100%. :)

-- Brane


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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Matthias Seidel
In reply to this post by Andrea Pescetti-2
Hi Andrea,

Am 13.11.18 um 22:23 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:

> Matthias Seidel wrote:
>> I think it would be a good idea to upgrade Serf in our builds.
>> What about the others (real developers)? ;-)
>
> Years ago, we had to avoid upgrading Serf in 4.1.x as Serf had started
> to require SCons for the build and we didn't want to introduce yet
> another build system since we already had too many.
>
> I see it still requires SCons, but probably we've included support for
> SCons in trunk in the meantime, so... well, we decided we can live
> with yet another build system! Still, I doubt we can use it for 4.1.x
> as SCons integration would be needed and I don't think we support it
> in 4.1.x.
I forgot to mention that I indeed build with trunk. And the build is
still going on, so anything can happen... ;-)

I will keep you updated!

Regards,

   Matthias

>
> Regards,
>   Andrea.
>
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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Andrea Pescetti-2
Matthias Seidel wrote:
> I forgot to mention that I indeed build with trunk. And the build is
> still going on, so anything can happen... ;-)

The current lack of time only allows me to contribute with memories from
the past when I was actually able to do stuff... but if I recall
correctly there are two important test scenarios where we use Serf:

1. Update checks for OpenOffice and extensions.

2. All WebDAV operations. You can find somewhere in Bugzilla a patch
that didn't make it to 4.1.2 due to excessive complexity (build
requirements). The Serf upgrade was meant to supplement WebDAV fixes in
4.1.2.

So you might want to focus testing on these two scenarios (the second
one will probably be tricky).

Regards,
   Andrea.

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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Pedro Lino-3

> On November 13, 2018 at 10:08 PM Andrea Pescetti <[hidden email]> wrote:

> 2. All WebDAV operations. You can find somewhere in Bugzilla a patch
> that didn't make it to 4.1.2 due to excessive complexity (build
> requirements). The Serf upgrade was meant to supplement WebDAV fixes in
> 4.1.2.
>
> So you might want to focus testing on these two scenarios (the second
> one will probably be tricky).

I can help with testing this feature. I use AOO for editing files on a webdav folder.
I use Windows 7 Pro, Ubuntu 16.04 and 18.04 (all x64)
Let me know when the builds are ready ;)

Regards,
Pedro

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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Peter Kovacs-3
In reply to this post by Matthias Seidel
How about trying to open an URL as a test case?

Is serf moving away from SCONs? I ask since we want to move to SCONs. An experience exchange would be great.

All the best
Peter


Am 13. November 2018 22:43:03 MEZ schrieb Matthias Seidel <[hidden email]>:

>Hi Andrea,
>
>Am 13.11.18 um 22:23 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
>> Matthias Seidel wrote:
>>> I think it would be a good idea to upgrade Serf in our builds.
>>> What about the others (real developers)? ;-)
>>
>> Years ago, we had to avoid upgrading Serf in 4.1.x as Serf had
>started
>> to require SCons for the build and we didn't want to introduce yet
>> another build system since we already had too many.
>>
>> I see it still requires SCons, but probably we've included support
>for
>> SCons in trunk in the meantime, so... well, we decided we can live
>> with yet another build system! Still, I doubt we can use it for 4.1.x
>> as SCons integration would be needed and I don't think we support it
>> in 4.1.x.
>
>I forgot to mention that I indeed build with trunk. And the build is
>still going on, so anything can happen... ;-)
>
>I will keep you updated!
>
>Regards,
>
>   Matthias
>
>>
>> Regards,
>>   Andrea.
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
>> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
>>

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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Branko Čibej
On 14.11.2018 08:16, Peter kovacs wrote:
> How about trying to open an URL as a test case?
>
> Is serf moving away from SCONs?

I surely hope so.

> I ask since we want to move to SCONs. An experience exchange would be great.

Well ... SCons looks amazingly good in tiny examples, but when it comes
to doing anything less than trivial, it's a nightmare. For example, I'm
not thrilled that we have platform-specific Python code in Serf's
SConstruct, and that's not even a very complex build at all. So, whilst
I really hate CMake for its inconsistencies and homegrown horrible macro
language, I like SCons quite a bit less.

All of the above is my "humble" opinion of course.

-- Brane


> Am 13. November 2018 22:43:03 MEZ schrieb Matthias Seidel <[hidden email]>:
>> Hi Andrea,
>>
>> Am 13.11.18 um 22:23 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
>>> Matthias Seidel wrote:
>>>> I think it would be a good idea to upgrade Serf in our builds.
>>>> What about the others (real developers)? ;-)
>>> Years ago, we had to avoid upgrading Serf in 4.1.x as Serf had
>> started
>>> to require SCons for the build and we didn't want to introduce yet
>>> another build system since we already had too many.
>>>
>>> I see it still requires SCons, but probably we've included support
>> for
>>> SCons in trunk in the meantime, so... well, we decided we can live
>>> with yet another build system! Still, I doubt we can use it for 4.1.x
>>> as SCons integration would be needed and I don't think we support it
>>> in 4.1.x.
>> I forgot to mention that I indeed build with trunk. And the build is
>> still going on, so anything can happen... ;-)
>>
>> I will keep you updated!
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>    Matthias
>>
>>> Regards,
>>>   Andrea.
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>>> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
>>>
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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Jim Jagielski
In reply to this post by Branko Čibej


> On Nov 13, 2018, at 4:40 PM, Branko Čibej <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> That's OK, any kind of testing, even with OO trunk, would be welcome.
> The only other Serf consumer I can test is Subversion, adding even one
> more would make out real-life testing increase by 100%. :)
>

OT: IMO, Serf would have a much wider consumer market if there were at least the most minimal documentation available for it.



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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Peter Kovacs-3
In reply to this post by Branko Čibej
Yea platform specific code should be avoided. But in my humble opinion that is not an issue of the build system itself but of suboptimal usage.

Thanks for your view! :)

Am 14. November 2018 13:08:21 MEZ schrieb "Branko Čibej" <[hidden email]>:

>On 14.11.2018 08:16, Peter kovacs wrote:
>> How about trying to open an URL as a test case?
>>
>> Is serf moving away from SCONs?
>
>I surely hope so.
>
>> I ask since we want to move to SCONs. An experience exchange would be
>great.
>
>Well ... SCons looks amazingly good in tiny examples, but when it comes
>to doing anything less than trivial, it's a nightmare. For example, I'm
>not thrilled that we have platform-specific Python code in Serf's
>SConstruct, and that's not even a very complex build at all. So, whilst
>I really hate CMake for its inconsistencies and homegrown horrible
>macro
>language, I like SCons quite a bit less.
>
>All of the above is my "humble" opinion of course.
>
>-- Brane
>
>
>> Am 13. November 2018 22:43:03 MEZ schrieb Matthias Seidel
><[hidden email]>:
>>> Hi Andrea,
>>>
>>> Am 13.11.18 um 22:23 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
>>>> Matthias Seidel wrote:
>>>>> I think it would be a good idea to upgrade Serf in our builds.
>>>>> What about the others (real developers)? ;-)
>>>> Years ago, we had to avoid upgrading Serf in 4.1.x as Serf had
>>> started
>>>> to require SCons for the build and we didn't want to introduce yet
>>>> another build system since we already had too many.
>>>>
>>>> I see it still requires SCons, but probably we've included support
>>> for
>>>> SCons in trunk in the meantime, so... well, we decided we can live
>>>> with yet another build system! Still, I doubt we can use it for
>4.1.x
>>>> as SCons integration would be needed and I don't think we support
>it
>>>> in 4.1.x.
>>> I forgot to mention that I indeed build with trunk. And the build is
>>> still going on, so anything can happen... ;-)
>>>
>>> I will keep you updated!
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>>    Matthias
>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>   Andrea.
>>>>
>>>>
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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Matthias Seidel
In reply to this post by Pedro Lino-3
Hi Pedro,

Am 13.11.18 um 23:20 schrieb Pedro Lino:

>> On November 13, 2018 at 10:08 PM Andrea Pescetti <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> 2. All WebDAV operations. You can find somewhere in Bugzilla a patch
>> that didn't make it to 4.1.2 due to excessive complexity (build
>> requirements). The Serf upgrade was meant to supplement WebDAV fixes in
>> 4.1.2.
>>
>> So you might want to focus testing on these two scenarios (the second
>> one will probably be tricky).
> I can help with testing this feature. I use AOO for editing files on a webdav folder.
> I use Windows 7 Pro, Ubuntu 16.04 and 18.04 (all x64)
> Let me know when the builds are ready ;)
I just gave up on building AOO with Serf 1.3.9... ;-)

Given the problems with Scons mentioned by Andrea I think it is better
to focus on Serf 1.4.0 if we want to upgrade.

Regards,

   Matthias

>
> Regards,
> Pedro
>
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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Branko Čibej
On 15.11.2018 20:28, Matthias Seidel wrote:

> Hi Pedro,
>
> Am 13.11.18 um 23:20 schrieb Pedro Lino:
>>> On November 13, 2018 at 10:08 PM Andrea Pescetti <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> 2. All WebDAV operations. You can find somewhere in Bugzilla a patch
>>> that didn't make it to 4.1.2 due to excessive complexity (build
>>> requirements). The Serf upgrade was meant to supplement WebDAV fixes in
>>> 4.1.2.
>>>
>>> So you might want to focus testing on these two scenarios (the second
>>> one will probably be tricky).
>> I can help with testing this feature. I use AOO for editing files on a webdav folder.
>> I use Windows 7 Pro, Ubuntu 16.04 and 18.04 (all x64)
>> Let me know when the builds are ready ;)
> I just gave up on building AOO with Serf 1.3.9... ;-)
>
> Given the problems with Scons mentioned by Andrea I think it is better
> to focus on Serf 1.4.0 if we want to upgrade.

Note that if you want to go this way (and I do recommend it), I suggest
using Serf's trunk for now. The difference between trunk and the current
1.4.0 branch are a couple of bug fixes and the fact that trunk reports
version 2.0.

I also recommend using the CMake build — Serf can very handily be
included as a subproject into another CMake tree, let me know if you
need help with that, I can provide examples.

-- Brane


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Re: Does OpenOffice still use Serf?

Branko Čibej
On 15.11.2018 21:17, Branko Čibej wrote:

> On 15.11.2018 20:28, Matthias Seidel wrote:
>> Hi Pedro,
>>
>> Am 13.11.18 um 23:20 schrieb Pedro Lino:
>>>> On November 13, 2018 at 10:08 PM Andrea Pescetti <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>> 2. All WebDAV operations. You can find somewhere in Bugzilla a patch
>>>> that didn't make it to 4.1.2 due to excessive complexity (build
>>>> requirements). The Serf upgrade was meant to supplement WebDAV fixes in
>>>> 4.1.2.
>>>>
>>>> So you might want to focus testing on these two scenarios (the second
>>>> one will probably be tricky).
>>> I can help with testing this feature. I use AOO for editing files on a webdav folder.
>>> I use Windows 7 Pro, Ubuntu 16.04 and 18.04 (all x64)
>>> Let me know when the builds are ready ;)
>> I just gave up on building AOO with Serf 1.3.9... ;-)
>>
>> Given the problems with Scons mentioned by Andrea I think it is better
>> to focus on Serf 1.4.0 if we want to upgrade.
> Note that if you want to go this way (and I do recommend it), I suggest
> using Serf's trunk for now. The difference between trunk and the current
> 1.4.0 branch are a couple of bug fixes and the fact that trunk reports
> version 2.0.
>
> I also recommend using the CMake build — Serf can very handily be
> included as a subproject into another CMake tree, let me know if you
> need help with that, I can provide examples.


Has anyone managed to make any progress on this? Any results available?

-- Brane

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