Forums and Wiki VM Migrations

[Gavin McDonald]

Hi All,

The OpenOffice forums - https://forum.openoffice.org <https://forum.openoffice.org/>

and

The OpenOffice wiki - https://wiki.openoffice.org <https://wiki.openoffice.org/>

are both housed on old VMware VMS which are in turn hosted on
old hardware.

We need to migrate these services over to new fully puppetized VMs.

I imagine that identifying all the nuts and bolts of these services will take a
bit of time to go through, and to puppetize everything that we can.

I propose that someone here might like to create a Confluence wiki page for
each service where everyone can follow along. (Not strictly necessary as this
is mostly a one time operation)
I will be here on list and also liaising through the INFRA Jira tickets [1][2].

A volunteer or two to assist with communication between Infra and the
Openoffice communities (such as those using and managing the Forums -
particularly since some of those dont follow the mailing lists or Jira.) would
be nice.

A volunteer or two who wants to be involved in the actual migration process
would also be nice so that we have folks here with some working knowledge
by the end of the process.

I aim to start the process of both migrations simultaneously but I do expect
differing finishing lines. My current expectations are that we could be done
between 1 and 2 months.

Any queries please reply to the dev list or the relevant INFRA jira tickets.

Fact finding on the hardware requirements and disk configurations are the
first step in the process and I am ready to begin that step now - who wants
to join in ?

Myself and Daniel ‘pono’ will be the main Infra peeps taking this on.

Thanks for getting this far.

Gav…

[1] - https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-13281 <https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-13281>
[2] - https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-13275 <https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-13275>

[Andrea Pescetti-2]

Gavin McDonald wrote:
> https://forum.openoffice.org ...
> https://wiki.openoffice.org ...
> We need to migrate these services over to new fully puppetized VMs.

One thing to remember: while we can live without buildbots (that were
left crippled by a similar infrastructure upgrade) we can't have a long
downtime for the Forum or Wiki; so if Infra is embarking on this, then
this time the job must be completed successfully. I see the JIRA issues
already take care of stating this, but it's better to point it out again.

> I imagine that identifying all the nuts and bolts of these services will take a
> bit of time to go through, and to puppetize everything that we can.

Speaking as probably the only active person in maintaining the services,
I can say that the text files available to Infra (not publicly
accessible, but ask me the URL if needed) describe reasonably well the
setup. The wiki is mostly normal, but the forum is crazy (for historical
reasons).

> I will be here on list and also liaising through the INFRA Jira tickets [1][2].

Thank you. I don't see it necessary to create a wiki page for the
migration but if it helps, no problem.

> A volunteer or two to assist with communication between Infra and the
> Openoffice communities (such as those using and managing the Forums -
> particularly since some of those dont follow the mailing lists or Jira.) would
> be nice.
> A volunteer or two who wants to be involved in the actual migration process
> would also be nice so that we have folks here with some working knowledge
> by the end of the process.

I volunteer for the second part: I don't have a lot of spare time, but
at the moment I'm the only person with recent experience of managing the
services. I've subscribed to both JIRA issues.

Regards,
   Andrea.

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[Gavin McDonald]

Hi,

> On 28 Jun 2017, at 2:18 am, Andrea Pescetti <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Gavin McDonald wrote:
>> https://forum.openoffice.org ...
>> https://wiki.openoffice.org ...
>> We need to migrate these services over to new fully puppetized VMs.
>
> One thing to remember: while we can live without buildbots (that were left crippled by a similar infrastructure upgrade) we can't have a long downtime for the Forum or Wiki; so if Infra is embarking on this, then this time the job must be completed successfully. I see the JIRA issues already take care of stating this, but it's better to point it out again.

This deserves another thread so I’ll do that shortly.

>
>> I imagine that identifying all the nuts and bolts of these services will take a
>> bit of time to go through, and to puppetize everything that we can.
>
> Speaking as probably the only active person in maintaining the services, I can say that the text files available to Infra (not publicly accessible, but ask me the URL if needed) describe reasonably well the setup. The wiki is mostly normal, but the forum is crazy (for historical reasons).

Right. I have been involved in the initial setup and upgrades of both services so we should be good.

>
>> I will be here on list and also liaising through the INFRA Jira tickets [1][2].
>
> Thank you. I don't see it necessary to create a wiki page for the migration but if it helps, no problem.

The wiki page was not to help me, but rather the project as a whole as future documentation to refer to.

>
>> A volunteer or two to assist with communication between Infra and the
>> Openoffice communities (such as those using and managing the Forums -
>> particularly since some of those dont follow the mailing lists or Jira.) would
>> be nice.
>> A volunteer or two who wants to be involved in the actual migration process
>> would also be nice so that we have folks here with some working knowledge
>> by the end of the process.
>
> I volunteer for the second part: I don't have a lot of spare time, but at the moment I'm the only person with recent experience of managing the services. I've subscribed to both JIRA issues.

Great, thanks.

Gav…

>
> Regards,
>  Andrea.


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[Gavin McDonald]

Hi

> On 28 Jun 2017, at 2:18 am, Andrea Pescetti <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Gavin McDonald wrote:
>> https://forum.openoffice.org ...
>> https://wiki.openoffice.org ...
>> We need to migrate these services over to new fully puppetized VMs.
>
> One thing to remember: while we can live without buildbots (that were left crippled by a similar infrastructure upgrade) we can't have a long downtime for the Forum or Wiki; so if Infra is embarking on this, then this time the job must be completed successfully. I see the JIRA issues already take care of stating this, but it's better to point it out again

The Operating Systems were upgraded on some Buildbot VMS whilst others were replaced altogether. Mostly, I see this as the OpenOffice project need to keep up to speed with Operating Systems, associated software packages for those systems and ensure that the OpenOffice software can run on ever evolving systems. Windows 7 as an example was EOL years ago and security updates no longer available. Ubuntu 12.04 the same thing. You are complaining we replaced 5 year old and 10 year old Operating systems and that this broke your builds.

Builds break, upgrades of Operating Systems and their underlying software packages happen. Our build systems will always be evolving so projects must learn to cope with this and ensure their builds change with it.

I would like to have all the OpenOffice builds fixed. So, please open INFRA tickets for all broken builds where you see that INFRA needs to do something - install software etc. But sitting around doing nothing is not going
to get them fixed.

Gav…





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[Matthias Seidel]

Am 28.06.2017 um 02:59 schrieb Gavin McDonald:

Hi

On 28 Jun 2017, at 2:18 am, Andrea Pescetti [hidden email] wrote:

Gavin McDonald wrote:

https://forum.openoffice.org ...
https://wiki.openoffice.org ...
We need to migrate these services over to new fully puppetized VMs.

One thing to remember: while we can live without buildbots (that were left crippled by a similar infrastructure upgrade) we can't have a long downtime for the Forum or Wiki; so if Infra is embarking on this, then this time the job must be completed successfully. I see the JIRA issues already take care of stating this, but it's better to point it out again

The Operating Systems were upgraded on some Buildbot VMS whilst others were replaced altogether. Mostly, I see this as the OpenOffice project need to keep up to speed with Operating Systems, associated software packages for those systems and ensure that the OpenOffice software can run on ever evolving systems. Windows 7 as an example was EOL years ago and security updates no longer available. Ubuntu 12.04 the same thing. You are complaining we replaced 5 year old and 10 year old Operating systems and that this broke your builds. 

Hi Gavin,

Are you mixing up Windows 7 with Windows XP?

https://support.microsoft.com/en-US/help/13853/windows-lifecycle-fact-sheet

Windows 7 will not be EOL until 2020 (and MS might even extend that date, given the market share)

Apart from that, OpenOffice builds perfectly on Windows 10, the problem is the compiler that was changed in the buildbot. We do need a specific building environment.

Builds break, upgrades of Operating Systems and their underlying software packages happen. Our build systems will always be evolving so projects must learn to cope with this and ensure their builds change with it.

Acknowledged.
Last week I set up a VM with Windows 10 and did successfully build AOO. I would love to get our Windows buildbots running again.

I would like to have all the OpenOffice builds fixed. So, please open INFRA tickets for all broken builds where you see that INFRA needs to do something - install software etc. But sitting around doing nothing is not going
to get them fixed. 

Oh yes, I see.
But looking at my last contact with Infra, someone else should open those tickets... :-D

Regards, Matthias

Gav…





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[Matthias Seidel]

Hi Andrea,

After the migration I would love to have some kind of administrative
access to the Wiki.
Would that be possible?

Kind regards, Matthias


Am 27.06.2017 um 18:18 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:

> Gavin McDonald wrote:
>> https://forum.openoffice.org ...
>> https://wiki.openoffice.org ...
>> We need to migrate these services over to new fully puppetized VMs.
>
> One thing to remember: while we can live without buildbots (that were
> left crippled by a similar infrastructure upgrade) we can't have a
> long downtime for the Forum or Wiki; so if Infra is embarking on this,
> then this time the job must be completed successfully. I see the JIRA
> issues already take care of stating this, but it's better to point it
> out again.
>
>> I imagine that identifying all the nuts and bolts of these services
>> will take a
>> bit of time to go through, and to puppetize everything that we can.
>
> Speaking as probably the only active person in maintaining the
> services, I can say that the text files available to Infra (not
> publicly accessible, but ask me the URL if needed) describe reasonably
> well the setup. The wiki is mostly normal, but the forum is crazy (for
> historical reasons).
>
>> I will be here on list and also liaising through the INFRA Jira
>> tickets [1][2].
>
> Thank you. I don't see it necessary to create a wiki page for the
> migration but if it helps, no problem.
>
>> A volunteer or two to assist with communication between Infra and the
>> Openoffice communities (such as those using and managing the Forums -
>> particularly since some of those dont follow the mailing lists or
>> Jira.) would
>> be nice.
>> A volunteer or two who wants to be involved in the actual migration
>> process
>> would also be nice so that we have folks here with some working
>> knowledge
>> by the end of the process.
>
> I volunteer for the second part: I don't have a lot of spare time, but
> at the moment I'm the only person with recent experience of managing
> the services. I've subscribed to both JIRA issues.
>
> Regards,
>   Andrea.
>
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[Andrea Pescetti-2]

Matthias Seidel wrote:
> After the migration I would love to have some kind of administrative
> access to the Wiki.
> Would that be possible?

Sure, we just need (lazy) consensus from this list, i.e., nobody saying
that they oppose, so that's easy. What access would you like to have?

1) Access to the wiki itself (current administrators: Keith, who is
doing most of the work -basically, accounts creation- and me). No
particular skills needed, everything is done in browser.

2) Shell access to the VM (here I don't know who has access exactly, but
the only active, or semi-active, one would be me). Here the work
concerns mainly the occasional MediaWiki upgrade. Average sysadmin
skills needed. This is managed by Infra, but Infra will still want to
have lazy consensus from this list.

Note: when I say "wiki" above, I mean MWiki aka https://wiki.openoffice.org/

Regards,
   Andrea.

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[Matthias Seidel]

Hi Andrea,

Am 28.06.2017 um 18:03 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:

> Matthias Seidel wrote:
>> After the migration I would love to have some kind of administrative
>> access to the Wiki.
>> Would that be possible?
>
> Sure, we just need (lazy) consensus from this list, i.e., nobody
> saying that they oppose, so that's easy. What access would you like to
> have?
>
> 1) Access to the wiki itself (current administrators: Keith, who is
> doing most of the work -basically, accounts creation- and me). No
> particular skills needed, everything is done in browser.

I am not sure.
I already have an account and can modify content. But I would like to
edit some links and graphics to get the Wiki in line with our other
pages. If that can be done with this access I am totally happy.

>
> 2) Shell access to the VM (here I don't know who has access exactly,
> but the only active, or semi-active, one would be me). Here the work
> concerns mainly the occasional MediaWiki upgrade. Average sysadmin
> skills needed. This is managed by Infra, but Infra will still want to
> have lazy consensus from this list.

I think this is not needed...

>
> Note: when I say "wiki" above, I mean MWiki aka
> https://wiki.openoffice.org/

Me too! ;-)

Regards, Matthias

>
> Regards,
>   Andrea.
>
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[Andrea Pescetti-2]

On 28/06/2017 Gavin McDonald wrote:
> You are complaining we replaced 5 year old and 10 year old Operating systems and that this broke your builds.

No, I was complaining that newer versions of other software were
installed and this (although I can understand that there may have been
incompatibilities) caused issues. I see Infra is now taking action about
this and I highly appreciate it - and in the meantime we are testing
Matthias' builds that were done on Windows 10, so I think things can be
restored.

On the "old OS" discussion: to keep it short, our release builds must be
done on an old system as they will run on any Linux-based system that is
NEWER than the one used for building. Of course, insofar as we use
buildbots just to check that the build doesn't break, it's fine to keep
them recent; but if we were to use them to build releases, then we have
to do it on an old system. This holds for Linux, probably not for
Windows and Mac.

Regards,
   Andrea.

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