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Google Apps

Winter
This is why after years I have now stopped using Open Office and
switched to Google Apps. I am a programmer. I quickly dump software that
does not comply to User Ergonomics. It should be simple and intuitive.
Especially the simplest task. All I wanted was to set up a budget like I
have many time in Open Office but the Sum command now does not sum. Why?
I read online suggestions which mentioned it could have something to do
with the value being treated as Text with no explanation to convert them
to numerical values. It seemed quickly much easier to sign in to Google.
Goodbye. I have little patience when companies make simple tasks
complicated.


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Re: Google Apps

Howard Blum
Don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out!

On Feb 14, 2018 1:39 PM, "Winter" <[hidden email]> wrote:

This is why after years I have now stopped using Open Office and switched
to Google Apps. I am a programmer. I quickly dump software that does not
comply to User Ergonomics. It should be simple and intuitive. Especially
the simplest task. All I wanted was to set up a budget like I have many
time in Open Office but the Sum command now does not sum. Why? I read
online suggestions which mentioned it could have something to do with the
value being treated as Text with no explanation to convert them to
numerical values. It seemed quickly much easier to sign in to Google.
Goodbye. I have little patience when companies make simple tasks
complicated.


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Re: Google Apps

Martin Groenescheij
In reply to this post by Winter
This mailing list is to get help from users like you and me.
As you're not subscribed to this mailing list and haven't asked for help


On 15/02/18 8:31 AM, Winter wrote:
> This is why after years I have now stopped using Open Office and
> switched to Google Apps. I am a programmer.

I expect from programmers that they know the difference between
importing Numbers and Text.

> I quickly dump software that does not comply to User Ergonomics. It
> should be simple and intuitive. Especially the simplest task.

Then Google Apps. is the tool for you, please come back when you need to
do more complex tasks.

> All I wanted was to set up a budget like I have many time in Open
> Office but the Sum command now does not sum. Why? I read online
> suggestions which mentioned it could have something to do with the
> value being treated as Text with no explanation to convert them to
> numerical values.

If you have Cells formatted as Text it will store imported values as
text, at the top you can see a ` in front of the number when stored as text.
Changing the Cell format to numeric doesn't help.  You can use a formula
like =VALUE(A1:A25) in a empty column and Paste Special the result
back into Column A with only the numeric option ticked.

> It seemed quickly much easier to sign in to Google. Goodbye. I have
> little patience when companies make simple tasks complicated.
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
>
>


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Re: Google Apps

Winter
In reply to this post by Winter
My point. I have never seen Tech Support so unprofessional ever. I don't
care if you like my attitude you do not troll former customers.


At 15:31 14/02/2018 -0600, you wrote:

> This is why after years I have now stopped using Open Office and
> switched to Google Apps.

Ah, so you have been using it successfully for years?

> I am a programmer.

Good: so you'll know what you are doing, then.

> I quickly dump software that does not comply to User Ergonomics.

Er, hold on: you are dumping OpenOffice "quickly" after using it for
years? That makes no sense at all!

> It should be simple and intuitive. Especially the simplest task.

Yes, matters should be made as simple as passable, but that is by no
means always trivial. If I buy a piano, I don't expect playing the
Moonlight Sonata to come easily: I have to learn how to operate the
instrument. If I buy a car, I don't expect to be able to complete the
"simplest task" of driving to work without extensive lessons and setting
up fuel, licensing, insurance, and so on. Using computer software is
similar: you need to expect to learn how to drive it before you can be
proficient. It's very difficult to see how you are a programmer but
apparently do not appreciate this simple idea.

> All I wanted was to set up a budget like I have many time in Open
> Office but the Sum command now does not sum.

Well, it does, of course - and you know it does, as you have used it
before. Nothing has changed. Simple logic implies that you are now
simply doing something different to create your problem, although you
may well not recognise this.

> Why? I read online suggestions which mentioned it could have something
> to do with the value being treated as Text with no explanation to
> convert them to numerical values.

If you don't understand this distinction, you are very much a beginner
at using spreadsheets - and you will find the same problem whichever
spreadsheet software you choose to use - yes, even Google's. What you
see is *not* what you get in spreadsheets, and never has been:

o What is displayed in a spreadsheet cell is a *version* of the value
hidden in that cell, according to the formatting of that cell - which
you may have set explicitly or may have been determined from what you
typed or pasted. For your spreadsheets to work, you need to be aware of
the format type of all your data.

o When you type values into a spreadsheet, they are - possibly invisibly
- edited by the software to determine what is actually stored in the
cell. This is a convenience, in fact, but will confuse you if you have
not learned the basics about spreadsheets. (You will not be the first
person to make this mistake.)

> It seemed quickly much easier to sign in to Google. Goodbye.

You are very welcome, of course, to choose to use any alternative
software you wish. Yes, really. But if speed means to you avoiding
learning about the tool and about your own mistakes, you will find the
same problems in the future. Google's offering will behave in a very
similar way; if it didn't, users would be complaining! In particular, if
you enter your data there *in exactly the same way* (do not confuse
typing with pasting, for example), you will see the same results there.
Why not - instead of complaining that OpenOffice doesn't work - ask
about your problem on the mailing list and learn the solution?

> I have little patience when companies make simple tasks complicated.

Again, this makes no sense:
o You cannot say that you have "little patience" with something after
claiming to have used it for years!
o Surely you know enough about OpenOffice to appreciate that it is
created by a cooperative venture, not a "company"?
o Like most things, when you understand it, you will find the way
spreadsheets work a convenience, not a complication.

OK: now to your problem. If you have managed to enter values as text
instead of as numbers, you will not expect to be able to calculate with
them. But there are easy solutions. You may need to set the format of
cells before you enter data (though you probably don't, in fact). If you
have entered values inappropriately, there are easy ways to correct your
mistake. You can find these in the help text, in the documentation
available from the web site (you have read this, haven't you?), through
a web search, or by asking on this mailing list.

It always amuses me when people making such claims choose to advertise
them to hundreds, perhaps a thousand or two, of fellow users around the
world, most of whom will understand the software well enough not to find
the same problems. Why not describe your problem instead and obtain help?

I trust this helps.

Brian Barker - privately

On 2/14/2018 3:31 PM, Winter wrote:

> This is why after years I have now stopped using Open Office and
> switched to Google Apps. I am a programmer. I quickly dump software
> that does not comply to User Ergonomics. It should be simple and
> intuitive. Especially the simplest task. All I wanted was to set up a
> budget like I have many time in Open Office but the Sum command now
> does not sum. Why? I read online suggestions which mentioned it could
> have something to do with the value being treated as Text with no
> explanation to convert them to numerical values. It seemed quickly
> much easier to sign in to Google. Goodbye. I have little patience when
> companies make simple tasks complicated.
>

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Fwd: Re: Google Apps

Winter
In reply to this post by Martin Groenescheij

My opinion is correct and I don't take time with people whose responses
are nothing more than to inflame. I was your customer. If this is the
way your Tech rsponds to customers I can see why you create an inferior
product. You could have listened to my concerns instead you want to
defend yourself by attacking me. I made the comment that I quickly
changed to Google Apps and one smart ass responded... o I thought you
used it for years. There is no reason to respond to you. You know damn
well the intent of my sentence and if you think masquerading as Forum
Troll is the same as providing tech support. I stand by what I said your
product should not be so complicated that I have to dig through forums
to do your job.

-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: Re: Google Apps
Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2018 09:40:17 +1100
From: Martin Groenescheij <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: [hidden email]
To: [hidden email]
CC: Winter <[hidden email]>



This mailing list is to get help from users like you and me.
As you're not subscribed to this mailing list and haven't asked for help


On 15/02/18 8:31 AM, Winter wrote:
> This is why after years I have now stopped using Open Office and
> switched to Google Apps. I am a programmer.

I expect from programmers that they know the difference between
importing Numbers and Text.

> I quickly dump software that does not comply to User Ergonomics. It
> should be simple and intuitive. Especially the simplest task.

Then Google Apps. is the tool for you, please come back when you need to
do more complex tasks.

> All I wanted was to set up a budget like I have many time in Open
> Office but the Sum command now does not sum. Why? I read online
> suggestions which mentioned it could have something to do with the
> value being treated as Text with no explanation to convert them to
> numerical values.

If you have Cells formatted as Text it will store imported values as
text, at the top you can see a ` in front of the number when stored as text.
Changing the Cell format to numeric doesn't help.  You can use a formula
like =VALUE(A1:A25) in a empty column and Paste Special the result
back into Column A with only the numeric option ticked.

> It seemed quickly much easier to sign in to Google. Goodbye. I have
> little patience when companies make simple tasks complicated.
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
>
>

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Re: Google Apps

Winter
In reply to this post by Martin Groenescheij


On 2/14/2018 4:40 PM, Martin Groenescheij wrote:

> This mailing list is to get help from users like you and me.
> As you're not subscribed to this mailing list and haven't asked for help
>
>
> On 15/02/18 8:31 AM, Winter wrote:
>> This is why after years I have now stopped using Open Office and
>> switched to Google Apps. I am a programmer.
>
> I expect from programmers that they know the difference between
> importing Numbers and Text.
>
>> I quickly dump software that does not comply to User Ergonomics. It
>> should be simple and intuitive. Especially the simplest task.
>
> Then Google Apps. is the tool for you, please come back when you need
> to do more complex tasks.
>
>> All I wanted was to set up a budget like I have many time in Open
>> Office but the Sum command now does not sum. Why? I read online
>> suggestions which mentioned it could have something to do with the
>> value being treated as Text with no explanation to convert them to
>> numerical values.
>
> If you have Cells formatted as Text it will store imported values as
> text, at the top you can see a ` in front of the number when stored as
> text.
> Changing the Cell format to numeric doesn't help.  You can use a
> formula like =VALUE(A1:A25) in a empty column and Paste Special the
> result
> back into Column A with only the numeric option ticked.

I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text. I
copied the values from the cells into the adjacent column and still it
did not recognize the numbers as text. I was programming in HEX
modularly when you were in Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do not
need your condescension in remarking that perhaps I need something
simple. Your job as tech support is to consider the input from your
customers not to take amateurish  cheap shots. You have a problem with
your product. Perhaps if you would listen to your customers instead of
taking juvenile asinine responses.

>
>> It seemed quickly much easier to sign in to Google. Goodbye. I have
>> little patience when companies make simple tasks complicated.
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
>> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
>>
>>
>


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Re: Google Apps

Winter
I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text. I
copied the values per the instructions from a forum using the Value
command  from the cells into the adjacent column and still it did not
recognize the numbers as text. I was programming in HEX modularly when
you were in Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do not need your
condescension in remarking that perhaps I need something simple. Your
job as tech support is to consider the input from your customers not to
take amateurish cheap shots. You have a problem with your product.
Perhaps if you would listen to your customers instead of taking juvenile
asinine responses.


On 2/15/2018 6:38 AM, Winter wrote:

> I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
> distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text.
> I copied the values from the cells into the adjacent column and still
> it did not recognize the numbers as text. I was programming in HEX
> modularly when you were in Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do
> not need your condescension in remarking that perhaps I need something
> simple. Your job as tech support is to consider the input from your
> customers not to take amateurish cheap shots. You have a problem with
> your product. Perhaps if you would listen to your customers instead of
> taking juvenile asinine responses.


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Re: Google Apps

Winter
I am tired of companies creating inferior products. I hate MS. My OS
lasts about 6 months before Groove stops working and then all I get is
a... oops something went wrong, as tech support which is better than
Googling HEX codes only to find a page of Google response trying to get
me to install a RegCleaner. I do not like having to google for tech
support over a simple Sum command. I know how to create Spreadsheets. I
created United Ways Fund Distribution Spreadhseets in Excel for our
local chapter interconnecting 64 agencies. I have done volunteer work
for years creating customized sheets with VB. I program in C++,
Assembler, Fortran, Cobol, VB. I was an IIS Admin and Database designer
in SQL for a major company and created an Intranet before they existed.
I taught myself to code in HEX at 16 by taking the OS apart. I know what
I am doing and your software is not intuitive. And if you don't like the
criticism I don't care. Your job as tech support is not to insult me.
Period. No matter how much I piss you off. You may not like my attitude
but I am tired of having software that is doesn't do what it should do.


On 2/15/2018 6:46 AM, Winter wrote:

> I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
> distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text.
> I copied the values per the instructions from a forum using the Value
> command  from the cells into the adjacent column and still it did not
> recognize the numbers as text. I was programming in HEX modularly when
> you were in Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do not need your
> condescension in remarking that perhaps I need something simple. Your
> job as tech support is to consider the input from your customers not
> to take amateurish cheap shots. You have a problem with your product.
> Perhaps if you would listen to your customers instead of taking
> juvenile asinine responses.
>
>
> On 2/15/2018 6:38 AM, Winter wrote:
>> I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand
>> the distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be
>> text. I copied the values from the cells into the adjacent column and
>> still it did not recognize the numbers as text. I was programming in
>> HEX modularly when you were in Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I
>> do not need your condescension in remarking that perhaps I need
>> something simple. Your job as tech support is to consider the input
>> from your customers not to take amateurish cheap shots. You have a
>> problem with your product. Perhaps if you would listen to your
>> customers instead of taking juvenile asinine responses.
>


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Re: Google Apps

Wade Smart-2
In reply to this post by Winter
Isnt it interesting that while spamming the list you still do not
understand that - it is NOT tech support, you are talking to
ordinary, every day, technical and non users and it is your
attitude and most likely overstated skills that are on display.
You are not a customer. You are a user. You downloaded the
software free of charge, free to use, free to fail on your own.
How sad it is you can not step back and see your own issues
but choose to thrash everyone else.
--
Registered Linux User: #480675
Registered Linux Machine: #408606
Linux since June 2005


On Thu, Feb 15, 2018 at 6:22 AM, Winter <[hidden email]> wrote:

> My point. I have never seen Tech Support so unprofessional ever. I don't
> care if you like my attitude you do not troll former customers.
>
>
> At 15:31 14/02/2018 -0600, you wrote:
>
>> This is why after years I have now stopped using Open Office and switched
>> to Google Apps.
>
>
> Ah, so you have been using it successfully for years?
>
>> I am a programmer.
>
>
> Good: so you'll know what you are doing, then.
>
>> I quickly dump software that does not comply to User Ergonomics.
>
>
> Er, hold on: you are dumping OpenOffice "quickly" after using it for years?
> That makes no sense at all!
>
>> It should be simple and intuitive. Especially the simplest task.
>
>
> Yes, matters should be made as simple as passable, but that is by no means
> always trivial. If I buy a piano, I don't expect playing the Moonlight
> Sonata to come easily: I have to learn how to operate the instrument. If I
> buy a car, I don't expect to be able to complete the "simplest task" of
> driving to work without extensive lessons and setting up fuel, licensing,
> insurance, and so on. Using computer software is similar: you need to expect
> to learn how to drive it before you can be proficient. It's very difficult
> to see how you are a programmer but apparently do not appreciate this simple
> idea.
>
>> All I wanted was to set up a budget like I have many time in Open Office
>> but the Sum command now does not sum.
>
>
> Well, it does, of course - and you know it does, as you have used it before.
> Nothing has changed. Simple logic implies that you are now simply doing
> something different to create your problem, although you may well not
> recognise this.
>
>> Why? I read online suggestions which mentioned it could have something to
>> do with the value being treated as Text with no explanation to convert them
>> to numerical values.
>
>
> If you don't understand this distinction, you are very much a beginner at
> using spreadsheets - and you will find the same problem whichever
> spreadsheet software you choose to use - yes, even Google's. What you see is
> *not* what you get in spreadsheets, and never has been:
>
> o What is displayed in a spreadsheet cell is a *version* of the value hidden
> in that cell, according to the formatting of that cell - which you may have
> set explicitly or may have been determined from what you typed or pasted.
> For your spreadsheets to work, you need to be aware of the format type of
> all your data.
>
> o When you type values into a spreadsheet, they are - possibly invisibly -
> edited by the software to determine what is actually stored in the cell.
> This is a convenience, in fact, but will confuse you if you have not learned
> the basics about spreadsheets. (You will not be the first person to make
> this mistake.)
>
>> It seemed quickly much easier to sign in to Google. Goodbye.
>
>
> You are very welcome, of course, to choose to use any alternative software
> you wish. Yes, really. But if speed means to you avoiding learning about the
> tool and about your own mistakes, you will find the same problems in the
> future. Google's offering will behave in a very similar way; if it didn't,
> users would be complaining! In particular, if you enter your data there *in
> exactly the same way* (do not confuse typing with pasting, for example), you
> will see the same results there. Why not - instead of complaining that
> OpenOffice doesn't work - ask about your problem on the mailing list and
> learn the solution?
>
>> I have little patience when companies make simple tasks complicated.
>
>
> Again, this makes no sense:
> o You cannot say that you have "little patience" with something after
> claiming to have used it for years!
> o Surely you know enough about OpenOffice to appreciate that it is created
> by a cooperative venture, not a "company"?
> o Like most things, when you understand it, you will find the way
> spreadsheets work a convenience, not a complication.
>
> OK: now to your problem. If you have managed to enter values as text instead
> of as numbers, you will not expect to be able to calculate with them. But
> there are easy solutions. You may need to set the format of cells before you
> enter data (though you probably don't, in fact). If you have entered values
> inappropriately, there are easy ways to correct your mistake. You can find
> these in the help text, in the documentation available from the web site
> (you have read this, haven't you?), through a web search, or by asking on
> this mailing list.
>
> It always amuses me when people making such claims choose to advertise them
> to hundreds, perhaps a thousand or two, of fellow users around the world,
> most of whom will understand the software well enough not to find the same
> problems. Why not describe your problem instead and obtain help?
>
> I trust this helps.
>
> Brian Barker - privately
>
> On 2/14/2018 3:31 PM, Winter wrote:
>>
>> This is why after years I have now stopped using Open Office and switched
>> to Google Apps. I am a programmer. I quickly dump software that does not
>> comply to User Ergonomics. It should be simple and intuitive. Especially the
>> simplest task. All I wanted was to set up a budget like I have many time in
>> Open Office but the Sum command now does not sum. Why? I read online
>> suggestions which mentioned it could have something to do with the value
>> being treated as Text with no explanation to convert them to numerical
>> values. It seemed quickly much easier to sign in to Google. Goodbye. I have
>> little patience when companies make simple tasks complicated.
>>
>

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Re: Google Apps

Howard Blum
In reply to this post by Winter
Can't someone pull the plug on this world class jerk?

On Feb 15, 2018 5:15 AM, "Winter" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I am tired of companies creating inferior products. I hate MS. My OS lasts
> about 6 months before Groove stops working and then all I get is a... oops
> something went wrong, as tech support which is better than Googling HEX
> codes only to find a page of Google response trying to get me to install a
> RegCleaner. I do not like having to google for tech support over a simple
> Sum command. I know how to create Spreadsheets. I created United Ways Fund
> Distribution Spreadhseets in Excel for our local chapter interconnecting 64
> agencies. I have done volunteer work for years creating customized sheets
> with VB. I program in C++, Assembler, Fortran, Cobol, VB. I was an IIS
> Admin and Database designer in SQL for a major company and created an
> Intranet before they existed. I taught myself to code in HEX at 16 by
> taking the OS apart. I know what I am doing and your software is not
> intuitive. And if you don't like the criticism I don't care. Your job as
> tech support is not to insult me. Period. No matter how much I piss you
> off. You may not like my attitude but I am tired of having software that is
> doesn't do what it should do.
>
>
> On 2/15/2018 6:46 AM, Winter wrote:
>
>> I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
>> distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text. I
>> copied the values per the instructions from a forum using the Value
>> command  from the cells into the adjacent column and still it did not
>> recognize the numbers as text. I was programming in HEX modularly when you
>> were in Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do not need your
>> condescension in remarking that perhaps I need something simple. Your job
>> as tech support is to consider the input from your customers not to take
>> amateurish cheap shots. You have a problem with your product. Perhaps if
>> you would listen to your customers instead of taking juvenile asinine
>> responses.
>>
>>
>> On 2/15/2018 6:38 AM, Winter wrote:
>>
>>> I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
>>> distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text. I
>>> copied the values from the cells into the adjacent column and still it did
>>> not recognize the numbers as text. I was programming in HEX modularly when
>>> you were in Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do not need your
>>> condescension in remarking that perhaps I need something simple. Your job
>>> as tech support is to consider the input from your customers not to take
>>> amateurish cheap shots. You have a problem with your product. Perhaps if
>>> you would listen to your customers instead of taking juvenile asinine
>>> responses.
>>>
>>
>>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
>
>
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Re: Google Apps

Wade Smart-2
In reply to this post by Winter
HAHAA

You talk like what you say means something to someone other than you.
It does not. You spout off names of things you have done and yet, you
do not know how to input values into a simple spread sheet.

Your criticism is laughable. You are a drive by spammer to the list!!
You did not ask for help. You didnt hardly state the problem. You started
bitching like a little child. What is very clear is you either cant or wont read
or understand what is being told to you about what you call tech support
and you have a massively overinflated view of yourself and your claimed skills.
"I know what I am doing and your software is not intuitive." HAHAH  What is
funny is - you are bitch queen. That is someone who spams just to bitch.
You dont what answers or help but to bitch. Mostly about yourself.

How sad a person you must be. I feel sorry for you. Good luck
--
Registered Linux User: #480675
Registered Linux Machine: #408606
Linux since June 2005


On Thu, Feb 15, 2018 at 6:59 AM, Winter <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I am tired of companies creating inferior products. I hate MS. My OS lasts
> about 6 months before Groove stops working and then all I get is a... oops
> something went wrong, as tech support which is better than Googling HEX
> codes only to find a page of Google response trying to get me to install a
> RegCleaner. I do not like having to google for tech support over a simple
> Sum command. I know how to create Spreadsheets. I created United Ways Fund
> Distribution Spreadhseets in Excel for our local chapter interconnecting 64
> agencies. I have done volunteer work for years creating customized sheets
> with VB. I program in C++, Assembler, Fortran, Cobol, VB. I was an IIS Admin
> and Database designer in SQL for a major company and created an Intranet
> before they existed. I taught myself to code in HEX at 16 by taking the OS
> apart. I know what I am doing and your software is not intuitive. And if you
> don't like the criticism I don't care. Your job as tech support is not to
> insult me. Period. No matter how much I piss you off. You may not like my
> attitude but I am tired of having software that is doesn't do what it should
> do.
>
>
>
> On 2/15/2018 6:46 AM, Winter wrote:
>>
>> I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
>> distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text. I
>> copied the values per the instructions from a forum using the Value command
>> from the cells into the adjacent column and still it did not recognize the
>> numbers as text. I was programming in HEX modularly when you were in
>> Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do not need your condescension in
>> remarking that perhaps I need something simple. Your job as tech support is
>> to consider the input from your customers not to take amateurish cheap
>> shots. You have a problem with your product. Perhaps if you would listen to
>> your customers instead of taking juvenile asinine responses.
>>
>>
>> On 2/15/2018 6:38 AM, Winter wrote:
>>>
>>> I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
>>> distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text. I
>>> copied the values from the cells into the adjacent column and still it did
>>> not recognize the numbers as text. I was programming in HEX modularly when
>>> you were in Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do not need your
>>> condescension in remarking that perhaps I need something simple. Your job as
>>> tech support is to consider the input from your customers not to take
>>> amateurish cheap shots. You have a problem with your product. Perhaps if you
>>> would listen to your customers instead of taking juvenile asinine responses.
>>
>>
>
>
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Re: Google Apps

Howard Blum
Thanks for your spot on comments Wade.

On Feb 15, 2018 6:56 AM, "Wade Smart" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> HAHAA
>
> You talk like what you say means something to someone other than you.
> It does not. You spout off names of things you have done and yet, you
> do not know how to input values into a simple spread sheet.
>
> Your criticism is laughable. You are a drive by spammer to the list!!
> You did not ask for help. You didnt hardly state the problem. You started
> bitching like a little child. What is very clear is you either cant or
> wont read
> or understand what is being told to you about what you call tech support
> and you have a massively overinflated view of yourself and your claimed
> skills.
> "I know what I am doing and your software is not intuitive." HAHAH  What is
> funny is - you are bitch queen. That is someone who spams just to bitch.
> You dont what answers or help but to bitch. Mostly about yourself.
>
> How sad a person you must be. I feel sorry for you. Good luck
> --
> Registered Linux User: #480675
> Registered Linux Machine: #408606
> Linux since June 2005
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 15, 2018 at 6:59 AM, Winter <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> > I am tired of companies creating inferior products. I hate MS. My OS
> lasts
> > about 6 months before Groove stops working and then all I get is a...
> oops
> > something went wrong, as tech support which is better than Googling HEX
> > codes only to find a page of Google response trying to get me to install
> a
> > RegCleaner. I do not like having to google for tech support over a simple
> > Sum command. I know how to create Spreadsheets. I created United Ways
> Fund
> > Distribution Spreadhseets in Excel for our local chapter interconnecting
> 64
> > agencies. I have done volunteer work for years creating customized sheets
> > with VB. I program in C++, Assembler, Fortran, Cobol, VB. I was an IIS
> Admin
> > and Database designer in SQL for a major company and created an Intranet
> > before they existed. I taught myself to code in HEX at 16 by taking the
> OS
> > apart. I know what I am doing and your software is not intuitive. And if
> you
> > don't like the criticism I don't care. Your job as tech support is not to
> > insult me. Period. No matter how much I piss you off. You may not like my
> > attitude but I am tired of having software that is doesn't do what it
> should
> > do.
> >
> >
> >
> > On 2/15/2018 6:46 AM, Winter wrote:
> >>
> >> I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
> >> distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text. I
> >> copied the values per the instructions from a forum using the Value
> command
> >> from the cells into the adjacent column and still it did not recognize
> the
> >> numbers as text. I was programming in HEX modularly when you were in
> >> Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do not need your condescension in
> >> remarking that perhaps I need something simple. Your job as tech
> support is
> >> to consider the input from your customers not to take amateurish cheap
> >> shots. You have a problem with your product. Perhaps if you would
> listen to
> >> your customers instead of taking juvenile asinine responses.
> >>
> >>
> >> On 2/15/2018 6:38 AM, Winter wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
> >>> distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text.
> I
> >>> copied the values from the cells into the adjacent column and still it
> did
> >>> not recognize the numbers as text. I was programming in HEX modularly
> when
> >>> you were in Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do not need your
> >>> condescension in remarking that perhaps I need something simple. Your
> job as
> >>> tech support is to consider the input from your customers not to take
> >>> amateurish cheap shots. You have a problem with your product. Perhaps
> if you
> >>> would listen to your customers instead of taking juvenile asinine
> responses.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
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> > For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
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Re: Google Apps

Dave Fisher
Hi - even though we are ALL VOLUNTEERS! We can be more polite. Fight fire with water not more fire.

Winter should be asked to provide an example and which OS/version he has. If the SUM function has broken then perhaps a VOLUNTEER developer can debug.

Thanks to the VOLUNTEERS here, but let’s be nice to people. We are all PEOPLE here and not a CORPORATION.

Thanks,
Dave

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 15, 2018, at 7:11 AM, Howard Blum <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Thanks for your spot on comments Wade.
>
>> On Feb 15, 2018 6:56 AM, "Wade Smart" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> HAHAA
>>
>> You talk like what you say means something to someone other than you.
>> It does not. You spout off names of things you have done and yet, you
>> do not know how to input values into a simple spread sheet.
>>
>> Your criticism is laughable. You are a drive by spammer to the list!!
>> You did not ask for help. You didnt hardly state the problem. You started
>> bitching like a little child. What is very clear is you either cant or
>> wont read
>> or understand what is being told to you about what you call tech support
>> and you have a massively overinflated view of yourself and your claimed
>> skills.
>> "I know what I am doing and your software is not intuitive." HAHAH  What is
>> funny is - you are bitch queen. That is someone who spams just to bitch.
>> You dont what answers or help but to bitch. Mostly about yourself.
>>
>> How sad a person you must be. I feel sorry for you. Good luck
>> --
>> Registered Linux User: #480675
>> Registered Linux Machine: #408606
>> Linux since June 2005
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 15, 2018 at 6:59 AM, Winter <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>> I am tired of companies creating inferior products. I hate MS. My OS
>> lasts
>>> about 6 months before Groove stops working and then all I get is a...
>> oops
>>> something went wrong, as tech support which is better than Googling HEX
>>> codes only to find a page of Google response trying to get me to install
>> a
>>> RegCleaner. I do not like having to google for tech support over a simple
>>> Sum command. I know how to create Spreadsheets. I created United Ways
>> Fund
>>> Distribution Spreadhseets in Excel for our local chapter interconnecting
>> 64
>>> agencies. I have done volunteer work for years creating customized sheets
>>> with VB. I program in C++, Assembler, Fortran, Cobol, VB. I was an IIS
>> Admin
>>> and Database designer in SQL for a major company and created an Intranet
>>> before they existed. I taught myself to code in HEX at 16 by taking the
>> OS
>>> apart. I know what I am doing and your software is not intuitive. And if
>> you
>>> don't like the criticism I don't care. Your job as tech support is not to
>>> insult me. Period. No matter how much I piss you off. You may not like my
>>> attitude but I am tired of having software that is doesn't do what it
>> should
>>> do.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 2/15/2018 6:46 AM, Winter wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
>>>> distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text. I
>>>> copied the values per the instructions from a forum using the Value
>> command
>>>> from the cells into the adjacent column and still it did not recognize
>> the
>>>> numbers as text. I was programming in HEX modularly when you were in
>>>> Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do not need your condescension in
>>>> remarking that perhaps I need something simple. Your job as tech
>> support is
>>>> to consider the input from your customers not to take amateurish cheap
>>>> shots. You have a problem with your product. Perhaps if you would
>> listen to
>>>> your customers instead of taking juvenile asinine responses.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On 2/15/2018 6:38 AM, Winter wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I had just opened the Sheet. There was no formatting. I understand the
>>>>> distinction in how to see if it is text. It did not appear to be text.
>> I
>>>>> copied the values from the cells into the adjacent column and still it
>> did
>>>>> not recognize the numbers as text. I was programming in HEX modularly
>> when
>>>>> you were in Kindergarten. I have an IQ over 160. I do not need your
>>>>> condescension in remarking that perhaps I need something simple. Your
>> job as
>>>>> tech support is to consider the input from your customers not to take
>>>>> amateurish cheap shots. You have a problem with your product. Perhaps
>> if you
>>>>> would listen to your customers instead of taking juvenile asinine
>> responses.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
>>>
>>
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>> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
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Re: Fwd: Re: Google Apps

jonathon-3
In reply to this post by Winter
On 02/15/2018 12:30 PM, Winter wrote:

> My opinion is correct

Your opinion holds water for you, and you alone.

For other people, your opinion is not only flat out wrong, but also
anti-intuitive, counter-productive, and guarantee to ensure zero
productivity.

>If this is the way your Tech responds to customers

You do realize that you are not communicating with tech support, don't you?

>I can see why you create an inferior product.

Inferior/superior has to do with the specific use case for which the
product is being used. For some use cases, Apache OpenOffice is several
orders of magnitude superior to Microsoft Office.  For other user cases,
the reverse is true.

>You could have listened to my concerns instead you want to

What is intuitive for one person, is anything but intuitive for another
person. Consider, for example, the difference between somebody who
learned keyboarding using vi, and somebody who learned keyboarding using
EMACS, and somebody who learnt keyboarding using WordStar.

All three users will be more productive (^1) in the environment that
they learned keyboarding in, than using a GUI interface. However, for
somebody who learned keyboarding via a GUI, vi, EMACS, and WordStar are
incomprehensible mysteries that are grossly inefficient.

>You know damn well the intent of my sentence

From where I'm sitting, your intent is either to prove that your IQ is
the reciprocal of what you claim it is, or else that you have zero
knowledge about keyboarding, data entry, or even computers in general
--- including how to use basic office software.

> product should not be so complicated that I have to dig through forums to do your job.

The job of the user is to learn what their tools are, and how to use
them. People that can't be bothered learning what their tools are, and
how to use them, find everything complicated.


^1: The research implies that a knowledgable user is more than twice as
productive using keyboard commands, and GUI commands.


jonathon

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Re: Google Apps

Dave Fisher
In reply to this post by Winter
Hi -

I’m not sure that you want help here, but if you have a bug to report then please do so with meaningful information along with respect for the volunteers from the OpenOffice community.

I think you know what meaningful information is needed, but here you go;

OS?
Version of OpenOffice? Did you get it from www.openoffice.org/download/?
Do you have a spreadsheet that shows the problem?
What steps do you follow that recreates the trouble?

You might also try:

Https://forum.openoffice.org/

Or,

Https://biz.apache.org/ooo/

Regards,
Dave

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 14, 2018, at 1:31 PM, Winter <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> This is why after years I have now stopped using Open Office and switched to Google Apps. I am a programmer. I quickly dump software that does not comply to User Ergonomics. It should be simple and intuitive. Especially the simplest task. All I wanted was to set up a budget like I have many time in Open Office but the Sum command now does not sum. Why? I read online suggestions which mentioned it could have something to do with the value being treated as Text with no explanation to convert them to numerical values. It seemed quickly much easier to sign in to Google. Goodbye. I have little patience when companies make simple tasks complicated.
>
>
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Re: Google Apps

John Hart-2
In reply to this post by Winter
On 2/14/2018 2:31 PM, Winter wrote:

> This is why after years I have now stopped using Open Office and
> switched to Google Apps. I am a programmer. I quickly dump software
> that does not comply to User Ergonomics. It should be simple and
> intuitive. Especially the simplest task. All I wanted was to set up a
> budget like I have many time in Open Office but the Sum command now
> does not sum. Why? I read online suggestions which mentioned it could
> have something to do with the value being treated as Text with no
> explanation to convert them to numerical values. It seemed quickly
> much easier to sign in to Google. Goodbye. I have little patience when
> companies make simple tasks complicated.
The responses to this post provide convincing evidence that
OSS needs public funding (tax credits) Unpaid volunteers provide
service for non contractual reasons that aren't clear to them
or users, and as 'products' and 'services' develop they tend to
diverge rather than converge on the needs of the individuals they
serve. This causes frustration to users, and when they vent their
feelings in the users group, it inevitably leads to a flame war
that NEVER seems to address the issues, but ends up a pissing
contest nobody wins.

jrh




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Re: Google Apps

Dave Fisher
Hi -

On Feb 15, 2018, at 10:12 AM, John Hart <[hidden email]> wrote:

The responses to this post provide convincing evidence that
OSS needs public funding (tax credits)

This is a completely different topic and many might disagree with your conclusion. Please explain how tax credits would help in detail.

OpenOffice is downloaded into almost every country in the world. The ASF is a non-profit under US law and donations may be tax deductible.


Regards,
Dave


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Re: Google Apps

John Hart-2
On 2/15/2018 11:20 AM, Dave Fisher wrote:

> Hi -
>
>> On Feb 15, 2018, at 10:12 AM, John Hart <[hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>>
>> The responses to this post provide convincing evidence that
>> OSS needs public funding (tax credits)
>
> This is a completely different topic and many might disagree with your
> conclusion. Please explain how tax credits would help in detail.
>
> OpenOffice is downloaded into almost every country in the world. The
> ASF is a non-profit under US law and donations may be tax deductible.
>
All business expenses are tax deductible! Correctly designed tax credits
can induce economic forces in
markets so they solve problems only evolutionary systems can. But that's
not the primary reason OSS
is needed. Without the source, it's all but impossible to determine if a
computer system is secure, and
in light of the fact power corrupts, what is evolving gets more
dangerous each day. Downloading anything
that isn't open, is like inviting a stranger into ones house. Everything
is fine until it isn't, then it's too late
to do anything about it.

There are things necessary to providing good service, programmers
donating time don't understand
and wouldn't want to do if they did, because they're mundane, time
consuming grunt work, so they
don't get done, and over time failure to do those things will undermine
the best of intention.

The details of tax credits would have to be worked out by a number of
people, I have some ideas but
discussing them is beyond the scope of my input now. What is clear now
is code can be dangerous,
and without checks and balances, disaster is all but guaranteed.

Had sun been given credit for it's contribution to OSS, it still might
exist, but companies that do what's
ethically right, have  a serious disadvantage competing with companies
that don't. Tax credits are the
only way I can see to correct this problem, if you have any other ideas,
feel free to express them.

jrh

*Sun Microsystems, Inc.*_*Was*_ an American company
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_company> which sold ...
Sun was a proponent of open systems in general and acquired software
such as StarOffice <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StarOffice>,...
Sun was the largest corporate contributor to open source movements in
the world.^[77]
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun_Microsystems#cite_note-MERIT-floss-77> ,
Sun's open source contributions exceed the combined total of the next
five largest commercial contributors.

Oracle Corporation <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oracle_Corporation>
acquired Sun <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun_acquisition_by_Oracle>
for US$7.4 billion...

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer>