JabRef interoperability with OOo

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JabRef interoperability with OOo

Morten Omholt Alver
Hi, all,

I manage the bibliography manager project JabRef
(http://jabref.sf.net). One of our most-requested features is
interoperability with Openoffice, and I really want to do something
about that.

Currently we have a spreadsheet export option that produces a
spreadsheet that can be used as bibliography data source in OOo 1.x.It
seems to me that a spreadsheet cannot be used in this way under OOo
2.0. Am I correct, or is this still possible (if so, how do I set
it?)?

As far as I know there are two other options that we could consider:

1. Communicating directly via the OOo socket (UNO)
2. Offer a database export that OOo can use

For either of these cases I need support - someone who can help me
understand how things work on the OOo side (or who can point out a
better alternative than those I listed). OpenOffice is a fairly
complicated product, so I think some inside help is necessary to get
the best possible solution. I hope someone is able and willing to
help!

Please tell me if there is a better place to address this request.


Yours sincerely,
Morten O. Alver


PS: I tried to post this a few weeks ago, but since it doesn't seem to
have reached the list, I'm trying again.

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Re: JabRef interoperability with OOo

David Wilson-8
Morton,

Good to hear from you. I have Jabref installed on my system and think you have
done a fine job.

On Thursday 12 January 2006 8:05 am, Morten Omholt Alver wrote:

> Hi, all,
>
> I manage the bibliography manager project JabRef
> (http://jabref.sf.net). One of our most-requested features is
> interoperability with Openoffice, and I really want to do something
> about that.
>
> Currently we have a spreadsheet export option that produces a
> spreadsheet that can be used as bibliography data source in OOo 1.x.It
> seems to me that a spreadsheet cannot be used in this way under OOo
> 2.0. Am I correct, or is this still possible (if so, how do I set
> it?)?
>
You can still use a text / spreadsheet  / csv file as a (read-only) OOo
bibliographic database in OOo version 2.

Just by chance I posted details of how to do this ysterday at
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Bibliographic_FAQ
I wrote this for someone asking how to use B3 (a java app similar to Jabref)
with  OpenOffice. B3 offers csv file export or writing to a ODBC database
that Openoffice can use.

I have only tested B3 with csv files without problems.

I have just download jabref 2beta, (it looks good) and OOo will not work with
the spread sheet or csv file produced by Jabref. I have not worked out why
but it is probably because the fields are not exactly the same (number, name
and  order) as in the original biblio database file.  For a start you have
'BibliographyType' rather than the orignal 'Type'.


To work out the correct format find
the .openoffce.org2/user/database/biblio/biblio.dbf file
and open it in the spreadsheet, were you can see the fields, You could save it
as a biblio.csv file and work from that.


> As far as I know there are two other options that we could consider:
>
> 1. Communicating directly via the OOo socket (UNO)

I think this is a nicer option. As it does not require the user to sup
databases etc.

I understand Bibus has done this but I have not got bibus to work on nys
system. It should not be too hard to translate the UNO calls in Python to
Java.

You could think of adding 'Insert Selection Citations into OpenOffice'

> 2. Offer a database export that OOo can use
>
You just need to set up an ODBC link. But again you need to make sure the  
fields are exactly the same (number name and  order) as in the original
biblio database file.

With OOo1.x I could connect to a MYSQL database and 'drag and drop' the
orignal biblio db into the MYSQL connection and it would give me the option
of copying fields and data to new MYSQL db. You can not get it much easier.

But I have not worked if one can or how to do this OOo2.


> For either of these cases I need support - someone who can help me
> understand how things work on the OOo side (or who can point out a
> better alternative than those I listed). OpenOffice is a fairly
> complicated product, so I think some inside help is necessary to get
> the best possible solution. I hope someone is able and willing to
> help!
We do not have expertise in our project but post to dev@openoffice or the list
dealing with UNO  [hidden email]

>
> Please tell me if there is a better place to address this request.
>
>
> Yours sincerely,
> Morten O. Alver
>
>
> PS: I tried to post this a few weeks ago, but since it doesn't seem to
> have reached the list, I'm trying again.
>
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> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

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Re: JabRef interoperability with OOo

Peter Tandler
Hi,

I agre that JabRef is a really nice tool and I would enjoy to see
it working together with OOo!

David Wilson wrote:
>> 2. Offer a database export that OOo can use
>>
> You just need to set up an ODBC link. But again you need to make sure the  
> fields are exactly the same (number name and  order) as in the original
> biblio database file.

Have you thought about allow end-user customization of the export
format, so that JabRef can export to any DB format or any CSV.
(I'm not sure to what extend this is possible already.)

Actually, it would be nice if JabRef could work with a DB as the
primary source for references, not only bibtex files, i.e. you
would open a database instead of a bibtex file. This would allow
users to use the /same/ source for references in both JabRef and
OOo, without the need to synchronize it later on, increasing
usability.

Cheers,
Peter

--
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Senior Researcher
Cooperative Environments and E-Learning
Fraunhofer IPSI
Dolivostrasse 15, 64293 Darmstadt, Germany
Phone: +49 6151 869-863, Fax: +49 6151 869-963
E-mail: [hidden email]
http://www.ipsi.fraunhofer.de/~tandler
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Re: JabRef interoperability with OOo

Morten Omholt Alver
In reply to this post by David Wilson-8
On 12/01/06, David Wilson <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> You can still use a text / spreadsheet  / csv file as a (read-only) OOo
> bibliographic database in OOo version 2.
>
> Just by chance I posted details of how to do this ysterday at
> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Bibliographic_FAQ
> I wrote this for someone asking how to use B3 (a java app similar to Jabref)
> with  OpenOffice. B3 offers csv file export or writing to a ODBC database
> that Openoffice can use.
>
> I have only tested B3 with csv files without problems.
>
> I have just download jabref 2beta, (it looks good) and OOo will not work with
> the spread sheet or csv file produced by Jabref. I have not worked out why
> but it is probably because the fields are not exactly the same (number, name
> and  order) as in the original biblio database file.  For a start you have
> 'BibliographyType' rather than the orignal 'Type'.
>
>
> To work out the correct format find
> the .openoffce.org2/user/database/biblio/biblio.dbf file
> and open it in the spreadsheet, were you can see the fields, You could save it
> as a biblio.csv file and work from that.

Thanks for posting these instructions - I couldn't figure out how to
use a csv/ods file as a database. It's good to know that this setup is
still possible. I'll look over this and see if I can make sure the
file is correctly exported in JabRef 2.0.

> > 1. Communicating directly via the OOo socket (UNO)
>
> I think this is a nicer option. As it does not require the user to sup
> databases etc.
>
> I understand Bibus has done this but I have not got bibus to work on nys
> system. It should not be too hard to translate the UNO calls in Python to
> Java.

I'll take a look at Bibus again, when I have the time.


Morten

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Re: JabRef interoperability with OOo

David Wilson-7
In reply to this post by Morten Omholt Alver
On Monday 16 January 2006 10:33 am, Morten Omholt Alver wrote:

> > > Thanks for posting these instructions - I couldn't figure out how to
> > > use a csv/ods file as a database. It's good to know that this setup is
> > > still possible. I'll look over this and see if I can make sure the
> > > file is correctly exported in JabRef 2.0.
> >
> > Let me kown how I can help
>
> Thanks! Looking over the column names did the trick. I changed the
> column order and names, plus I changed the sheet name from
> "Bibliography" to "biblio", and now it seems to work. I just released
> a second beta of 2.0, where this update is in. For the final version I
> plan to include instructions in the help files for how to set up
> OpenOffice to use the exported spreadsheet.

That is good news. When you have done this you could also update the JabRef
entry on the our 'Bibliographic Software and Standards Information' wiki
page.

http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Bibliographic_Software_and_Standards_Information

I shifted it to a wiki page so that developers and users can keep it up to
date.

David

>
>
> Morten

--
-------------------
David N. Wilson
Co-Project Lead for the Bibliographic
OpenOffice Project
http://bibliographic.openoffice.org

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Re: JabRef interoperability with OOo

David Wilson-7
In reply to this post by Morten Omholt Alver
On Tuesday 17 January 2006 1:28 pm, patricios1 Calderon wrote:
> Hi,
> Can we post problems with the different bibliographic program in wiki, in
> the discussion section perhaps? Thanks,

Patricio,

        I do not think the Openoffice Bibliographic project's 'Bibliographic Software
and Standards Information' wiki is a good place for discussing problems with
software, it is for general information about software and standards only.

If your question is about using different bibliographic programs WITH
OpenOffice then we might be able to help. You could post your question to
this list.

But if your question is about problems in using different bibliographic
programs then it would be best to contact the developer or the mail list for
that program.

If you think you have a question that you think other people might also need
answers to you could put it on the  Bibliographic FAQ  -
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Bibliographic_FAQ

Or If you have some Bibliographic Hints and Tips that may help other users
could put them on -
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Bibliographic_Hints_and_Tips

regards

David

-------------------
David N. Wilson
Co-Project Lead for the Bibliographic
OpenOffice Project
http://bibliographic.openoffice.org

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Re: JabRef interoperability with OOo

Roberto Rosselli Del Turco
In reply to this post by Peter Tandler
Il giorno ven, 13/01/2006 alle 09.14 +0100, Peter Tandler ha scritto:
> Hi,
>
> I agre that JabRef is a really nice tool and I would enjoy to see
> it working together with OOo!

I just discovered the beta version can export to TEI XML format, thanks
Morten!

Ciao

--
 
Roberto Rosselli Del Turco      roberto.rossellidelturco at unito.it
Dipartimento di Scienze         rosselli at ling.unipi.it
del Linguaggio                  Then spoke the thunder  DA
Universita' di Torino           Datta: what have we given?  (TSE)
 
  Hige sceal the heardra,     heorte the cenre,
  mod sceal the mare,       the ure maegen litlath.  (Maldon 312-3)


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Re: JabRef interoperability with OOo

Morten Omholt Alver
Hi,

I asked for help with making JabRef interoperate with OOo a while ago,
and received a number of useful responses. It's been a while, but I've
finally gotten somewhere using the UNO interface.

I've looked at the Bibus source code, and partly followed the method
used there (although Bibus is modelled after OOo's bibliography
features, so JabRef obviously needs to do some extra processing). I'm
planning to make a prototype version available for download as soon as
I have something presentable.

I have a question regarding duplicates in the bibliography. I thought
we could offer different citation types such as "Smith (2001)" vs.
"(Smith, 2001)" by manipulating the "Identifier" field appropriately.
To maintain JabRef's link with the entry in OOo, I set the "Custom5"
field to hold JabRef's bibtex key, and then the "Custom4" field to
hold a marker signifying which citation type is to be used ("t" for
in-text vs. "p" for parenthesized).

This use of the custom fields seems to work - JabRef can scan the
entries and find which ones are "known" entries by looking at the
"Custom5" field. But it seems to be problematic when I insert two
citations of different types of the same entry, because it then
appears twice in the bibliography. I assume this is because I am using
two different identifiers, making it impossible for OOo to know that
they are duplicates.

My question is: can I give two citations different appearances ("Smith
(2001)" in one place and "(Smith, 2001)" in another) and still make
them represent the same entry in the bibliography?

I'm sorry if this wasn't well explained, and please let me know if I
should be posting this question elsewhere.


Regards,
Morten

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Re: JabRef interoperability with OOo

David Wilson-7
 Morten,

        It is good hear that you are making so much progress. There must be some way
that Writer determines that two bibliographic entries are from the same  
reference so that only only bibliographic line is produced.

I would have guessed that it was the  entries with the same 'Identifier' as
in-
===========================
<text:p text:style-name="Standard">

Sample document with a citation

<text:bibliography-mark text:identifier="Veer1996a"
text:bibliography-type="book" text:address="New York"
text:author="Peter van der Veer" text:booktitle="Riots and Pogroms"
text:editor="Paul Brass"
text:pages="154-76"
text:publisher="NYU Press"
text:title="The Construction of Violence and Public Space in
Hindu Nationalism"
text:year="1996"
text:isbn="1223213123">

[Veer1996a]

</text:bibliography-mark>

and a bibliographic table.

</text:p>
===========================
I will be some research and testing over the next two days and let you know
what I find.

regards

David



On Friday 08 September 2006 5:37 am, Morten Omholt Alver wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I asked for help with making JabRef interoperate with OOo a while ago,
> and received a number of useful responses. It's been a while, but I've
> finally gotten somewhere using the UNO interface.
>
> I've looked at the Bibus source code, and partly followed the method
> used there (although Bibus is modelled after OOo's bibliography
> features, so JabRef obviously needs to do some extra processing). I'm
> planning to make a prototype version available for download as soon as
> I have something presentable.
>
> I have a question regarding duplicates in the bibliography. I thought
> we could offer different citation types such as "Smith (2001)" vs.
> "(Smith, 2001)" by manipulating the "Identifier" field appropriately.
> To maintain JabRef's link with the entry in OOo, I set the "Custom5"
> field to hold JabRef's bibtex key, and then the "Custom4" field to
> hold a marker signifying which citation type is to be used ("t" for
> in-text vs. "p" for parenthesized).
>
> This use of the custom fields seems to work - JabRef can scan the
> entries and find which ones are "known" entries by looking at the
> "Custom5" field. But it seems to be problematic when I insert two
> citations of different types of the same entry, because it then
> appears twice in the bibliography. I assume this is because I am using
> two different identifiers, making it impossible for OOo to know that
> they are duplicates.
>
> My question is: can I give two citations different appearances ("Smith
> (2001)" in one place and "(Smith, 2001)" in another) and still make
> them represent the same entry in the bibliography?
>
> I'm sorry if this wasn't well explained, and please let me know if I
> should be posting this question elsewhere.
>
>
> Regards,
> Morten
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]

--
-------------------
David N. Wilson
Co-Project Lead for the Bibliographic
OpenOffice Project
http://bibliographic.openoffice.org

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