OpenOffice.org 3.3 - PLS approve and request language versions

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Re: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - PLS approve and request language versions

Andrea Pescetti
On 09/02/2011 Marcus Lange wrote:
> These NL teams have no chance to release the builds as they have not the
> manpower, hardware for the final release tests or other reasons. Maybe
> they have a well localized build but how to get these builds to the users?

In the Italian community it just works to tell people that they should
test a version if they want it released (and people did actually join
our QA team this way). But other communities may be different (or, I
suspect, virtually inexistent in some cases), so I can't say this will
apply to them too.

> Especially for less used platforms like Solaris Sparc/x86, Linux 64-bit,
> MacOS Intel (regarding the tables) this could be very helpful.
> But maybe you have another idea how to help here? :-)

I'm proud to be able to tell people that, unlike other software projects
do, OpenOffice.org guarantees that each stable build we offer for
download has been thoroughly tested by volunteers. I will just restrict
this statement to the Italian version only in future, and it will be OK!

Regards,
  Andrea Pescetti - Italian N-L Project Lead.


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Re: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - PLS approve and request language versions

Thorsten Ziehm-2
Hi Andrea,

Am 18.02.2011 00:07, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:

> On 09/02/2011 Marcus Lange wrote:
>> These NL teams have no chance to release the builds as they have not the
>> manpower, hardware for the final release tests or other reasons. Maybe
>> they have a well localized build but how to get these builds to the users?
>
> In the Italian community it just works to tell people that they should
> test a version if they want it released (and people did actually join
> our QA team this way). But other communities may be different (or, I
> suspect, virtually inexistent in some cases), so I can't say this will
> apply to them too.
>
>> Especially for less used platforms like Solaris Sparc/x86, Linux 64-bit,
>> MacOS Intel (regarding the tables) this could be very helpful.
>> But maybe you have another idea how to help here? :-)
>
> I'm proud to be able to tell people that, unlike other software projects
> do, OpenOffice.org guarantees that each stable build we offer for
> download has been thoroughly tested by volunteers. I will just restrict
> this statement to the Italian version only in future, and it will be OK!

This statement isn't correct in detail. All L10N versions we are
releasing on OOo are tested by the L10N teams (volunteers). Without
their translation and their QA we do not ship a version. But you are
right some of the communities do not have the resources to release
(final check of the final bits and declare them as stable) all their
installation for all platforms - especially since the project split.
Here we want to help - nothing more and nothing less.

So the statement shouldn't be 'the download bits for other languages
aren't tested by volunteers'. 'The last approval wasn't done by the
teams for all platforms' - that's more correct. But this isn't evil ;-)
because the bits are tested, the general functionality is given and
if general problems with a language exists we get bug reports.

Thorsten

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Re: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - PLS approve and request language versions

Martin Srebotnjak
Hi *,

I have a small problem with the concept of automatic testing and approving
as well. The automatic testing after the time for manual testing has passed
presumes that all L10N teams want to release their language version.

However there could be a situation where the localization would be subpar
for the lang team translation quality criteria to release - but in your
scenario the team loses the possibility to stop the release in their
language (in the old system the lang team simply did not start testing the
release).

So the change is this: instead of
you test and release all builds you can
you are proposing
we will test and release all if you do not have resources or time

Of course the benefit to OOo is that it is released in many more languages.
But what good are these numbers if the localizations are not tested by
native speakers?

The automatic testing doesn't seem to go well with languages that do not
have tests localized - will now even languages without localized tests be
released as QAed?

I know many of these thoughts are speculations on my part, but I just want
to open discussion about questions that really matter
translation-quality-wise - the testing of which cannot be left to the
Hamburg team or computers - as they do not understand/speak ... Slovenian :)

Lp, m.
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Re: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - PLS approve and request language versions

Thorsten Ziehm-2
Hi Martin,

for me it isn't a problem, when a L10N team decide to do not the next
release. In the new concept they have to talk about this request. Is
it a problem for you?

But in my understanding their isn't a reason to do not release a
version, where a lot of work for translation and QA for this translation
is done. Why not release that version and wait for feedback. Perhaps
the users do not have such a problem with the quality which the L10N
team prioritize as a stopper. Without a released version you will not
get any feedback about that version. Because to find/download a RC is
much more complex as to find/download a stable/released version.

But it should be still possible to decide that a version of OOo will
not released for a special language.

Thorsten


Am 18.02.2011 10:16, schrieb Martin Srebotnjak:

> Hi *,
>
> I have a small problem with the concept of automatic testing and approving
> as well. The automatic testing after the time for manual testing has passed
> presumes that all L10N teams want to release their language version.
>
> However there could be a situation where the localization would be subpar
> for the lang team translation quality criteria to release - but in your
> scenario the team loses the possibility to stop the release in their
> language (in the old system the lang team simply did not start testing the
> release).
>
> So the change is this: instead of
> you test and release all builds you can
> you are proposing
> we will test and release all if you do not have resources or time
>
> Of course the benefit to OOo is that it is released in many more languages.
> But what good are these numbers if the localizations are not tested by
> native speakers?
>
> The automatic testing doesn't seem to go well with languages that do not
> have tests localized - will now even languages without localized tests be
> released as QAed?
>
> I know many of these thoughts are speculations on my part, but I just want
> to open discussion about questions that really matter
> translation-quality-wise - the testing of which cannot be left to the
> Hamburg team or computers - as they do not understand/speak ... Slovenian :)
>
> Lp, m.
>

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Re: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - PLS approve and request language versions

marcus.lange
Hi all,

IMHO this is the main point to release more languages/builds as in the
past. So +1 from my side.

Best regards

Marcus



Thorsten Ziehm wrote:
> is done. Why not release that version and wait for feedback. Perhaps
> the users do not have such a problem with the quality which the L10N
> team prioritize as a stopper. Without a released version you will not
> get any feedback about that version. Because to find/download a RC is


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Re: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - PLS approve and request language versions

marcus.lange
In reply to this post by Martin Srebotnjak
Martin Srebotnjak wrote:

Hi Martin,

> I know many of these thoughts are speculations on my part, but I just want
> to open discussion about questions that really matter
> translation-quality-wise - the testing of which cannot be left to the
> Hamburg team or computers - as they do not understand/speak ... Slovenian :)

luckily you have released all possible builds for Slovenian but just
imagine not. You know you haven't any issue specific to your language,
so IMHO you can assume that this is also valid for the builds of the
missing platforms. Now tell me that you would not be happy with our
offering to test and release them from our side. ;-)

I just want to add this again:
This is not to take over the release process from the NL teams.

Best regards

Marcus


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