Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Pedro Lino-3

> On January 29, 2019 at 7:21 PM Marcus <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Am 29.01.19 um 13:05 schrieb Pedro Lino:
> > Shouldn't AOO be concerned that previous users are not notified of new releases
> > (or extension updates)? The update notification mechanism has been broken for months. This means that  users
> > currently on any previous build weren't even notified that 4.1.6 was released 2 months ago...
> >
> > I realize that the update notification is working on 4.2.0 but how are users going to be notified to update to 4.2.0?
>
> If you mean the Beta release:
> We shouldn't activate the update service - because it's just a Beta
> which not suitable for any production use.

No, I mean that anyone who has AOO 4.1.5 (or previous) has NOT been notified that 4.1.6 was released.
The update notification mechanism is broken.
Isn't fixing regressions a priority for Apache OpenOffice?

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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Matthias Seidel
Am 29.01.19 um 21:53 schrieb Pedro Lino:

>> On January 29, 2019 at 7:21 PM Marcus <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Am 29.01.19 um 13:05 schrieb Pedro Lino:
>>> Shouldn't AOO be concerned that previous users are not notified of new releases
>>> (or extension updates)? The update notification mechanism has been broken for months. This means that  users
>>> currently on any previous build weren't even notified that 4.1.6 was released 2 months ago...
>>>
>>> I realize that the update notification is working on 4.2.0 but how are users going to be notified to update to 4.2.0?
>> If you mean the Beta release:
>> We shouldn't activate the update service - because it's just a Beta
>> which not suitable for any production use.
> No, I mean that anyone who has AOO 4.1.5 (or previous) has NOT been notified that 4.1.6 was released.
> The update notification mechanism is broken.
> Isn't fixing regressions a priority for Apache OpenOffice?
How is this related to 4.2.0 Beta?!

Please don't hijack threads... Just open up another one or change the topic.

Regards,

   Matthias

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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Pedro Lino-3

>     On January 29, 2019 at 9:02 PM Matthias Seidel < [hidden email] mailto:[hidden email] > wrote:
>
>
>

>     How is this related to 4.2.0 Beta?!
>

The subject of this email/topic is "Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?"

My opinion is that it is better to fix pending issues than to move on...

Unfortunately I can't fix the regression myself so I have to keep reminding the few people that can.

I think it is easy to understand that I'm not insisting on this subject to benefit myself (I can easily update AOO and ignore the problem) but to benefit all current AOO users...

Regards,
Pedro
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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Marcus (OOo)
Am 29.01.19 um 22:57 schrieb Pedro Lino:

>
>>      On January 29, 2019 at 9:02 PM Matthias Seidel < [hidden email] mailto:[hidden email] > wrote:
>
>>      How is this related to 4.2.0 Beta?!
>
> The subject of this email/topic is "Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?"
>
> My opinion is that it is better to fix pending issues than to move on...
>
> Unfortunately I can't fix the regression myself so I have to keep reminding the few people that can.
>
> I think it is easy to understand that I'm not insisting on this subject to benefit myself (I can easily update AOO and ignore the problem) but to benefit all current AOO users...

at the moment the root is not yet found (AFAIK, please say so when I'm
wrong) and a fix is therefore difficult. But sure, for the final 4.2.0
this probnlem should be fixed.

Marcus


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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Jim Jagielski
In reply to this post by Marcus (OOo)

sorry to ask, do you have also a screenshot for the About box?


Sure, no prob:


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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Jim Jagielski
In reply to this post by Matthias Seidel


> On Jan 29, 2019, at 7:52 AM, Matthias Seidel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Do you also build SDK and language pack as beta? See:
>
>

I do yes... my build scripts (see https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openoffice/devtools/build-scripts/4.2.0-dev)
have a '--beta' option that builds all the related Beta artifacts.

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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Marcus (OOo)
In reply to this post by Jim Jagielski
Am 30.01.19 um 14:24 schrieb Jim Jagielski:
>>
>> sorry to ask, do you have also a screenshot for the About box?
>>
>
> Sure, no prob:

thanks

It seems that the space is nearly full and we shouldn't squeeze much
more text into it.

What about a short sentence + link to a new webpage that gives more
information about the Beta release. Like:

For more information about this Beta release:
https://www.openoffice.org/AOO_420_Beta_This_Webpage_Needs_To_Be_Created.html

Of course this is just 1 of many channels where the user can find more
information.

Marcus


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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Matthias Seidel
In reply to this post by Jim Jagielski
Hi Jim,

Am 30.01.19 um 16:15 schrieb Jim Jagielski:

>
>> On Jan 29, 2019, at 7:52 AM, Matthias Seidel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Do you also build SDK and language pack as beta? See:
>>
>>
> I do yes... my build scripts (see https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openoffice/devtools/build-scripts/4.2.0-dev)
> have a '--beta' option that builds all the related Beta artifacts.
>
>
Ah, great! Did you change the scripts lately?

I was not "up to date"... ;-)

Regards,

   Matthias



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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Peter Kovacs-3
In reply to this post by Marcus (OOo)
AFAIK Root cause is that the TLS connection can not be established in
Version 1.2 due to wrong version on client side.

The Idea has been to lower security on server back to 1.1 Version for now.

On 30.01.19 00:11, Marcus wrote:

> Am 29.01.19 um 22:57 schrieb Pedro Lino:
>>
>>>      On January 29, 2019 at 9:02 PM Matthias Seidel <
>>> [hidden email] mailto:[hidden email] > wrote:
>>
>>>      How is this related to 4.2.0 Beta?!
>>
>> The subject of this email/topic is "Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?"
>>
>> My opinion is that it is better to fix pending issues than to move on...
>>
>> Unfortunately I can't fix the regression myself so I have to keep
>> reminding the few people that can.
>>
>> I think it is easy to understand that I'm not insisting on this
>> subject to benefit myself (I can easily update AOO and ignore the
>> problem) but to benefit all current AOO users...
>
> at the moment the root is not yet found (AFAIK, please say so when I'm
> wrong) and a fix is therefore difficult. But sure, for the final 4.2.0
> this probnlem should be fixed.
>
> Marcus
>
>
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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Andrea Pescetti-2
On 30/01/2019 Peter Kovacs wrote:
> AFAIK Root cause is that the TLS connection can not be established in
> Version 1.2 due to wrong version on client side.
> The Idea has been to lower security on server back to 1.1 Version for now.

I confirm this is the conclusion we reached, but then we (at least I)
haven't find the time for following up properly.

Thank you Pedro for the reminder, let's see if time allows for taking
action (server-side) on this soon! But I think there is no code bug to
address in this respect. For sure not for 4.2.0-beta where updates would
be disabled anyway.

Regards,
   Andrea.

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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Matthias Seidel
Am 31.01.19 um 23:33 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:

> On 30/01/2019 Peter Kovacs wrote:
>> AFAIK Root cause is that the TLS connection can not be established in
>> Version 1.2 due to wrong version on client side.
>> The Idea has been to lower security on server back to 1.1 Version for
>> now.
>
> I confirm this is the conclusion we reached, but then we (at least I)
> haven't find the time for following up properly.
>
> Thank you Pedro for the reminder, let's see if time allows for taking
> action (server-side) on this soon! But I think there is no code bug to
> address in this respect.
In the past month I had about 2 weeks where AOO 4.1.6 on Ubuntu 16.04
had a working connection to the update server. Now it is gone again... :-(
So it is clearly no problem in our code in the first place.

Also the download statistics show me that a great number of users (from
OOo 3.2 to AOO 4.1.5) have gotten the update notification and did update
via this channel.

> For sure not for 4.2.0-beta where updates would be disabled anyway.

I really see no reason for that... At least this was only a suggestion
from Marcus and hasn't been discussed further.

At the moment Beta builds for 4.2.0 point to
https://ooo-updates.apache.org/aoonextbeta/check.Update.
This is an empty feed just enough to respond "OpenOffice Beta 4.2.0 is
up to date." and it is already working. [1]

Regards,

   Matthias

[1] https://home.apache.org/~mseidel/AOO%204.2.0%20Beta%20Update%20feed.png

>
> Regards,
>   Andrea.
>
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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Pedro Lino-3
Hi Matthias, Andrea, all

>     On January 31, 2019 at 11:08 PM Matthias Seidel < [hidden email] mailto:[hidden email] > wrote:
>
>
>     Am 31.01.19 um 23:33 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
>
>         > >         On 30/01/2019 Peter Kovacs wrote:
> >
> >             > > >             AFAIK Root cause is that the TLS connection can not be established in
> > >             Version 1.2 due to wrong version on client side.
> > >             The Idea has been to lower security on server back to 1.1 Version for
> > >             now.
> > >
> > >         > >
> >     >
>         > >         I confirm this is the conclusion we reached, but then we (at least I)
> >         haven't find the time for following up properly.
> >
> >     >
>         > >         Thank you Pedro for the reminder, let's see if time allows for taking
> >         action (server-side) on this soon! But I think there is no code bug to
> >         address in this respect.
> >
> >     >
Thank you for listening ;)


>     In the past month I had about 2 weeks where AOO 4.1.6 on Ubuntu 16.04
>     had a working connection to the update server. Now it is gone again... :-(
>     So it is clearly no problem in our code in the first place.
>
It is even stranger that it works sometimes...
Clearly it has to be a change on the server side since the clients are not changing (e.g. on a Windows XP machine) and checking for updates worked previously


>     Also the download statistics show me that a great number of users (from
>     OOo 3.2 to AOO 4.1.5) have gotten the update notification and did update
>     via this channel.
>
Can you determine from which OS? I can't get it to work on any Windows version but Andrea mentioned that the update worked on some Linux distros (but not on Ubuntu)


>
>         > >         For sure not for 4.2.0-beta where updates would be disabled anyway.
> >
> >     >     I really see no reason for that... At least this was only a suggestion
>     from Marcus and hasn't been discussed further.
>
>     At the moment Beta builds for 4.2.0 point to
>     https://ooo-updates.apache.org/aoonextbeta/check.Update.
>     This is an empty feed just enough to respond "OpenOffice Beta 4.2.0 is
>     up to date." and it is already working. [1]
>

I don't see any reason to disable it... Even if a user forgets to remove the beta and then is notified that a new full version is available, after install all outdated files will be overwritten...

Regards,
Pedro
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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Jim Jagielski
Time for another ping... what does everyone think? Time?

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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Jim Jagielski
Just in case, I'm doing Beta builds of AOO42X (HEAD) for macOS and Linux 64+32

> On Feb 14, 2019, at 11:45 AM, Jim Jagielski <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Time for another ping... what does everyone think? Time?
>
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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

jd1008
Great! Please post the URL of the binaries so other people can start
testing.


On 02/14/2019 11:29 AM, Jim Jagielski wrote:

> Just in case, I'm doing Beta builds of AOO42X (HEAD) for macOS and Linux 64+32
>
>> On Feb 14, 2019, at 11:45 AM, Jim Jagielski <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Time for another ping... what does everyone think? Time?
>>
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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Marcus (OOo)
Am 14.02.19 um 19:39 schrieb JD:
> Great! Please post the URL of the binaries so other people can start
> testing.

this is the keyword:

First we need to do some tests on our own. Otherwise we risk to release
a beta that doesn't survive barley longer than a small smoketest.

The problem is that different people have different point of views how
good the quality should be before a beta should be release. Therefore I
cannot say what exactly has to be covered by a smoketest.

But up to know I haven't seen someone that has posted some tests results.

So, maybe the best time to define a standard set of test tasks that have
to be executed before a more public release like a beta release should
be done.

Opinions?

Marcus



> On 02/14/2019 11:29 AM, Jim Jagielski wrote:
>> Just in case, I'm doing Beta builds of AOO42X (HEAD) for macOS and
>> Linux 64+32
>>
>>> On Feb 14, 2019, at 11:45 AM, Jim Jagielski <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Time for another ping... what does everyone think? Time?


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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Matthias Seidel
In reply to this post by Jim Jagielski
Hi Jim,

IMO, the situation hasn't changed so much.

We should at least fix issue 125129 [1] before we release a (public)
beta. I have seen that Damjan is investigating...

Then we need time to inform translators on l10n@ before we can export
the latest translations from Pootle.
At the moment most of them are at 98% for the UI but the SDF files still
need to be updated in source.

Regards,

   Matthias

[1] https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=125129


Am 14.02.19 um 17:45 schrieb Jim Jagielski:
> Time for another ping... what does everyone think? Time?
>
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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Damjan Jovanovic
Bug 125129 looks like a wild goose chase and requires considerable
understanding of the framework layer, but I'll try continue when I have
time.

My own release checklist would include:
1. Library audit.
1.1 Did we lose or gain any public symbols in our libraries since the
4.1.0? Gbuild requires explicit export instead of exporting everything and
then possibly controlling visibility with a .map file, so it's very
possible.
1.2 Did ELF symbol versions on *nix platforms change? The older gbuild
modules probably did, as I didn't understand the meaning of .map files back
then.
1.3 Are the same libraries with the same names available in both 4.1.0 and
4.2.0?
2. Base:
2.1 Complete the Java SDBC driver framework, used by both the new SDBC-JDBC
bridge and the Postgres SDBC driver.
2.2 Audit the new SDBC-JDBC bridge in Java against the old C++ one, fix any
differences.
2.3 Complete the Postgres SDBC driver; still needs views, users, groups,
etc.
2.4 Complete the integration of the Postgres SDBC driver into the Base UI
forms (like MySQL already is).
3. Crashreporter
3.1 Get it working again.
3.2 Bug reported in UI form (instead of submitted to some now obsolete
server), which can be copied/pasted or attached to Bugzilla.
4. Testing
4.1 Run all available tests (unit tests, smoketest, module integration
tests, bvt, fvt, etc.) against 4.1.0 and 4.2.0, find and fix any
regressions.

Damjan


On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 1:25 AM Matthias Seidel <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Hi Jim,
>
> IMO, the situation hasn't changed so much.
>
> We should at least fix issue 125129 [1] before we release a (public)
> beta. I have seen that Damjan is investigating...
>
> Then we need time to inform translators on l10n@ before we can export
> the latest translations from Pootle.
> At the moment most of them are at 98% for the UI but the SDF files still
> need to be updated in source.
>
> Regards,
>
>    Matthias
>
> [1] https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=125129
>
>
> Am 14.02.19 um 17:45 schrieb Jim Jagielski:
> > Time for another ping... what does everyone think? Time?
> >
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> >
>
>
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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Rory O'Farrell
On Fri, 15 Feb 2019 11:55:32 +0200
Damjan Jovanovic <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Bug 125129 looks like a wild goose chase and requires considerable
> understanding of the framework layer, but I'll try continue when I have
> time.

A quick experiment with Writer in 4.2.0 shows me that one cannot insert a background fill (Area tab) when making a frame, but one can subsequently select the frame and then insert the background.
 
Also, the Frame toolbar does not show onscreen for me, so I am unable to attempt Linking frames, whether empty or with background fill.  Using /View /Toolbars : Frame turns off the Formatting toolbar, but does not display the Frame toolbar.  I am reasonably sure the Frame toolbar is not anywhere on my desktop (several monitors in use - checked it is not hidden behind anything).

(I am using AOO420m1(Build:9800)  -  Rev. 1851640
2019-01-19 15:48:21 (Sat, 19 Jan 2019) - Linux x86_64 [Apache OpenOffice Test Development Build] running on Xubuntu 18.04.02 64 bit)

I don't currently use Frames in any of my works in progress, so this is not a matter of any urgency for me.

I am of course ready to try any interim version (whether public or private) to examine any change in this or other problems.

--
Rory O'Farrell <[hidden email]>

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Re: Time for our first 4.2.0 beta?

Pedro Lino-3
In reply to this post by Jim Jagielski

> On February 14, 2019 at 4:45 PM Jim Jagielski <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
> Time for another ping... what does everyone think? Time?

How does a Beta version install on Linux?* Is it installed in parallel to the Stable version (like on Windows)?

If not then I believe the update problem should be fixed *before* releasing the Beta
https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=127774

Regards,
Pedro

* I was going to test a previous Beta instead of asking, but the archive for the only Beta does not contain any binaries http://archive.apache.org/dist/openoffice/4.1.0-beta/binaries/en-US/

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